Comments on: The Death of the Learning Management System? (part 1) http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/ Proud Sponsor of Your Future Thu, 19 Jan 2012 16:41:57 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: Matt Crosslin http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-223 Matt Crosslin Mon, 03 Mar 2008 09:28:29 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-223 Great thoughts there. What can you cay about the obsession and worry? We all wish it would go away, but probably won't.<br /><br />I think what you say in your second paragraph there kind of highlights what can go wrong in instructional design when you get too carried away with the 'coolness factor' of a tool and don't think in depth how to use it on a smaller scale in class. For example, setting up a blog for a class that would base success on people outside of class coming in and participating on your blog. I've talked to teachers about blogs as tools, and they see these successful blogs with in-depth extensive commenting happening every week, and wonder why that didn't happen in their class blogs. 'No one visits after class is over!' Or, what about starting a class wiki that they want to be in-depth as wikipedia, and then lamenting over the fact that students don't go that far. Bascially, they need to stop trying to be the next 'web 2.0 success stories' and start trying to just use a tool or website in a more appropriate context. Great thoughts there. What can you cay about the obsession and worry? We all wish it would go away, but probably won’t.

I think what you say in your second paragraph there kind of highlights what can go wrong in instructional design when you get too carried away with the ‘coolness factor’ of a tool and don’t think in depth how to use it on a smaller scale in class. For example, setting up a blog for a class that would base success on people outside of class coming in and participating on your blog. I’ve talked to teachers about blogs as tools, and they see these successful blogs with in-depth extensive commenting happening every week, and wonder why that didn’t happen in their class blogs. ‘No one visits after class is over!’ Or, what about starting a class wiki that they want to be in-depth as wikipedia, and then lamenting over the fact that students don’t go that far. Bascially, they need to stop trying to be the next ‘web 2.0 success stories’ and start trying to just use a tool or website in a more appropriate context.

]]> By: Eamon Costello http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-222 Eamon Costello Sun, 02 Mar 2008 12:26:51 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-222 An interesting article Matt.I agree that the death of the LMS/VLE is exaggerated as you say. Universities are becoming increasingly hierarchical and bureaucratic and starting to look a lot more like corporations. This is not all negative - in theory the extra support staff and bean counters should ultimately improve the educational environment for all and make it more accountable and efficient. But the price is the increasing centralization of control. The increased obsession with tracking student completion and performance. The increased worry over liability and anxiety of colleges to exert control over any intellectual property generated by students or teachers.Also I think the critical mass of users required for web 2.0 poster boys such as del.ico.us, google page rank, flickr etc. will never exist even in a very large class. The real web 2.0 success stories rely on mass participation to create things that individuals couldn't. I don't think these crowds could really manifest in the classroom. An interesting article Matt.I agree that the death of the LMS/VLE is exaggerated as you say. Universities are becoming increasingly hierarchical and bureaucratic and starting to look a lot more like corporations. This is not all negative – in theory the extra support staff and bean counters should ultimately improve the educational environment for all and make it more accountable and efficient. But the price is the increasing centralization of control. The increased obsession with tracking student completion and performance. The increased worry over liability and anxiety of colleges to exert control over any intellectual property generated by students or teachers.Also I think the critical mass of users required for web 2.0 poster boys such as del.ico.us, google page rank, flickr etc. will never exist even in a very large class. The real web 2.0 success stories rely on mass participation to create things that individuals couldn’t. I don’t think these crowds could really manifest in the classroom.

]]> By: Matt Crosslin http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-215 Matt Crosslin Tue, 26 Feb 2008 22:20:10 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-215 Just to point out, I did not say that it forces anything. One of their selling points is that they offer 'accountability,' and the time parameters are one of the tools they say is accountability. My point was that this type of accountability is a flawed system, one that it is, of course, used many places in online education. I don't think we are moving forward in online education when we use a flawed system as a selling point.<br /><br />Of course, I realize that this is a feature driven by market demand more than anything else, because I run in to people all over the place that want this kind of stuff in their classes.<br /> Just to point out, I did not say that it forces anything. One of their selling points is that they offer ‘accountability,’ and the time parameters are one of the tools they say is accountability. My point was that this type of accountability is a flawed system, one that it is, of course, used many places in online education. I don’t think we are moving forward in online education when we use a flawed system as a selling point.

Of course, I realize that this is a feature driven by market demand more than anything else, because I run in to people all over the place that want this kind of stuff in their classes.

]]> By: Steve Foreman http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-214 Steve Foreman Tue, 26 Feb 2008 16:54:23 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-214 Matt has a good point about the accountability as some people do learn at a faster speed. However, he is incorrect that MyiCourse forces the time parameters on those who use the system. The use of course times and testing are all optional. Each site owner can choose to use or avoid these features as they see fit. Matt has a good point about the accountability as some people do learn at a faster speed. However, he is incorrect that MyiCourse forces the time parameters on those who use the system. The use of course times and testing are all optional. Each site owner can choose to use or avoid these features as they see fit.

]]> By: Matt Crosslin http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-209 Matt Crosslin Tue, 05 Feb 2008 09:59:02 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-209 MyiCourse looks like they have some good ideas, but I disagree with their use of accountability. Setting time limits and keystroke minimums really means nothing, and would penalize learners, like me, that tend to move faster through material that we are interested in. I have been on these types of accountability systems, and they are just as easy to cheat as any other ones. People learn at different speeds. Being one of those that can soak up information faster than average, I really worry about methods like this.<br /><br />In my opinion, it's all based on a flawed educational model that values time spent staring at materials, rote memorization, and correct answers on a standardized test over actual real world application of knowledge. MyiCourse looks like they have some good ideas, but I disagree with their use of accountability. Setting time limits and keystroke minimums really means nothing, and would penalize learners, like me, that tend to move faster through material that we are interested in. I have been on these types of accountability systems, and they are just as easy to cheat as any other ones. People learn at different speeds. Being one of those that can soak up information faster than average, I really worry about methods like this.

In my opinion, it’s all based on a flawed educational model that values time spent staring at materials, rote memorization, and correct answers on a standardized test over actual real world application of knowledge.

]]> By: Steve Foreman http://www.edugeekjournal.com/2008/02/04/the-death-of-the-learning-management-system-part-1/comment-page-1/#comment-208 Steve Foreman Mon, 04 Feb 2008 15:59:06 +0000 http://www.edugeekjournal.com/?p=141#comment-208 Yes, the blogs and Wordpress are free, but they simply are not the correct tool for presenting course materials. There is no timing, no testing, no transcripts, and no accountability for the student. <br /><br />MyiCourse.com has actually been described as a cross between eBay and Blogger. It is free like Blogger and allows an instructor to monitize their information like eBay. The site allows you to create a sub-domain site for your courses. There is no limit on the number or length of courses. No limits on students and no contracts. And yes, it times, tests, transcribes and provides accountability. This site was just mentioned on the EdTechTalk podcast and you can Google MyIcourse for other comments. Yes, the blogs and WordPress are free, but they simply are not the correct tool for presenting course materials. There is no timing, no testing, no transcripts, and no accountability for the student.

MyiCourse.com has actually been described as a cross between eBay and Blogger. It is free like Blogger and allows an instructor to monitize their information like eBay. The site allows you to create a sub-domain site for your courses. There is no limit on the number or length of courses. No limits on students and no contracts. And yes, it times, tests, transcribes and provides accountability. This site was just mentioned on the EdTechTalk podcast and you can Google MyIcourse for other comments.

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